The ESPC Property Show: ESPC Explores the Scottish Borders

Paul

Hello, It's Paul and Megan, welcome to the ESPC Property Show. And today we are in

 

Megan

the Scottish Borders!

 

Paul

On the road again, out in the Scottish borders. It's a lovely day out there today. I'm wearing my bright, colorful pink shirt.

 

Megan

Yes.

 

Paul

And yeah, it's okay.

 

Megan

Yes, it's very, very.

 

Paul

Am I going to pop on camera?

 

Megan

You are going to pop on camera! So today we are visiting two towns in the Scottish borders. We're going to be going to Kelso and then we are going to Peebles, which is only a small part of the Scottish borders, but that's all we could fit in on our trip today. And so, yeah, we're very excited to speak to two firms as well.

 

Paul

Yeah, get a real feel about the market, what's happened in the market and what's coming up. It's really interesting because again, certainly since COVID we know there's been a real bounce in the property markets in these areas and we're just find out how much of a bounce they’ve had when we talk to them.

 

Megan

Yep. So Paul is going to go and speak to Suzanne we're going to tag team our chats today. So Paul will be speaking to Suzanne and then I'll be speaking to Struan in the afternoon. So yeah, the next thing you'll hear is Paul with Suzanne in Kelso.

 

Paul

Hello, it's Paul from ESPC, and today we are in the Borders and we're starting our journey in the borders in Kelso. Don't worry, Megan is with me. Megan is behind the camera, looking at me now, telling me to get on. I've got Suzanne who's I've got down as property manager from Hastings, is that right?

 

Suzanne

Yes. Based in Kelso.

 

Paul

Great to see you. Unfortunately, we have not got the Hastings's office in shots because we've got the beautiful town hall instead. We've just missed the chimes-We might get the 12:00 chimes actually. Okay, so we're just going to have a chat about the property markets. Suzanne, you've been Hastings Co for many years.

 

Suzanne

Yeah, 13 years.

 

Paul

So you've seen good markets, bad markets. And we were just chatting there where we off camera. Just the difference you've seen in the market since COVID, you know, there's been a real shift in the markets.

 

Suzanne

Oh, absolutely. I mean, it's still very active at the moment, but certainly, you know, post-COVID, we saw a huge influx of buyers coming from the city or from the south. And, you know, I would say that it has sort of perhaps settled a little bit. You know, it's returned to more normal levels, but still, you know, a lot higher than they were pre-pandemic.

And, you know, the borders are such a fantastic area. But I would also say that it's quite a resilient market. You know, I would say that also that, you know, we don't get the highs and lows in many other areas in the Scotland do.

 

Paul

Yeah, sure. But you certainly had some highs. I mean, I was looking at some of the statistics. So if we take Kelso, for instance, 21 days to sell at the moment, so really fast moving market, if we went back five years ago, it would be 21 weeks to sell, wouldn’t it?

 

Suzanne

So we're between sort of six and eight months was probably an average. And obviously that's changed somewhat since the sort of, you know, post-pandemic. Yeah.

 

Paul

So some of this is hybrid working, Is it, as you say, people that maybe have moved out from Edinburgh still do the commute, but it's only one or two days a week.

 

Suzanne

Absolutely. You know, a lot of buyers coming from Edinburgh, from the cities, but also a lot buyers coming from the south. I think, you know, COVID allowed, a lot of buyers, your chance to sort of revalue life as well to new cities, you know, Homeworking as well was a huge factor. And I think that's why, you know, the borders was probably relatively undiscovered, you know, people would go north or west whereas they are discovering the borders now because, you know, we are almost equidistant from Edinburgh and Newcastle and, you know, we've got the Borders railway, we've got the East Coast rail line. So you know, we're rural but we're accessible at the same time.

 

Paul

You selling it very well. I mean, I know as you say, it's so much more than the rugby, the ridings, the farming, there's a lot more here, isn't it?

 

Suzanne

There's so much the borders has got to offer. I mean, there's so much history in the borders as well. And, you know, so we're extremely lucky. We've got like some of, you know, the racecourse and the golf courses. You know, we've got the showground, we've been, you know, huge events to the Kelso and the borders. We've got Flora's castle.

But also Kelso you know, has so much history in regards to like we've got the lovely, you know, cobbled square, the town hall, free parking! Only for two hours though. And then we've also got like of you know that the abbey Yeah you know the meeting of the two rivers you know the Tweed and Teviot, you know it's such a picturesque area.

 

Paul

Well, let's talk a little bit about the housing stock in Kelso then. So if I was a first time buyer and I'm trying to get on the market, how much am I going to need to be able to buy a property in and around Kelso?

 

Suzanne

I think it depends on what kind of property you're looking for. I mean, across the borders, you know, I think it's quite an affordable area. You can find something for for everyone and I think in Kelso in particular, you know, is one of the most desirable areas, you will find that you'll pay a little bit more in comparison to other areas.

But I think, you know, definitely first time buyer, we're also finding, you know, over I'd say over the last ten years there's been quite a change in first time buyers. You know, traditionally they would go for, you know, your one, two bedroom flats, whereas now I would say that they're sort of pushing themselves with the help of mum and dad, you know, to a house really, you know, a semi-detached house if they can afford it.

 

Paul

So yeah, skipping the first level. Yeah. So what sort of price would you expect the flat to be or as you say, a two or three bedroom property.

 

Suzanne

Well so you know a flat you can buy flats for under 100,000.

 

Paul

Well that's good. That's good.

 

Suzanne

Absolutely. In comparison to like of Edinburgh.

 

Paul

Yeah.

 

Suzanne

And then like if you're, you know, two or three bedroom semi-detached properties, you're kind of looking at, you know, up to about £150,000-£160,000.

 

Paul

So that's.

 

Suzanne

You know, it's still very affordable

 

Paul

And as you say, not a huge difference between what you pay for a flat, and then to get a house with a garden I guess so more.

 

Suzanne

Yeah, it depends what area like anywhere you know where you're looking but yeah there's definitely you know first time buyers and we're finding you know more and more first time buyers are looking at the Borders.

 

Paul

Yeah. Okay thanks. It's good to know and in terms of, of a profile of buyers, we've recently done a podcast. We were down in Dumfries and we talking to firms there and they were saying a lot of the buyers are cash and it's people retiring to Kirkcudbright and he was saying it's cash.

 

The have you seen that? I mean, you mentioned there's people coming in from across the border, people coming to retire. Are property being bought up for cash?

 

Suzanne

Yeah. I mean, we're finding that we are getting more and more cash buyers. Certainly those buyers will be moving from the city or from the south. As I mentioned earlier, you know, property prices are fairly cheap in comparison. So I would say that, you know, quite a lot of those buyers are buying, you know, cash up here. Yeah.

 

Paul

And in terms of the just just the general amenities we’ve touched on the many things you can do here - if you're going to pick out, it's probably an unfair question, but I'll ask you anyway if you're going to pick out one beauty spot or three three beauty spots in the borders, give me three. Now, you mentioned the beach earlier, so maybe that's one of them?

 

Suzanne

Absolutely so the likes of Coldingham and St Abbs are such a beautiful area, very coastal you've got lovely walks round about there as well then you've got likes of Kelso. So I think the countryside round here is amazing and you know you're just to the 10 minutes from the Teviot Hills, which is, you know, a great advantage.

I'm a keen horse rider myself, so I'm very lucky and spoiled with the countryside. And then another beauty spot, I've got to say, Scots View is one of my favorites. You're overlooking the yielding and hills and it's an absolute beautiful spot in the borders.

 

Paul

So yeah, sounds like some lovely spots there, I suppose. Just sort of almost hand-in-hand with that. Where are you seeing the most activity then in terms of buyers if they come? Because as you say, the borders is a composite of many different places, isn't it. So so one of the maybe the top three most sought after places?

 

Suzanne

I would say the top three are probably Melrose, Peebles and Kelso. They're the three most desirable areas in the borders.

 

Paul

And why do you think why particularly those three?

 

Suzanne

I think there's so much going on, you know, there's so much history and on all three places, but they're also very different with Peebles, you've got your biking and mountain biking and Melrose, you know, as absolute beautiful fields and hills.

And then we've got the two rivers of, as mentioned earlier and all the history that comes with it. And they're just so picturesque of all three of them. And we're finding that, you know, certainly those buyers moving into the area, they just capture everyone's hearts. I think to a certain extent.

 

Paul

So, Suzanne, we always ask a question, this question, so it seems only right and fitting, what's your outlook for the rest of the year? You mentioned already the market is calmed a little in the last year or so. And we can see that in the statistics. You say things are still strong. How do you see the rest of the year playing out?

 

Suzanne

I think the market will continue as we are. You know, it's still active. I don't think it will so much if I'm being honest. I do think you'll also get that seasonal, you know, slowdown over Christmas. But we often find that, you know, when we come back after the new year, that things pick up fairly quickly in January.

You know, people either find that their house is too small over Christmas or they want to put their New Year plans into action. So often we do get that slow down towards the end of November, December, and then it picks up again fairly quickly.

 

Paul

Yeah, okay, that's great. Well, hopefully that's giving you some insight into Kelso. We'll be doing other bits of the Borders today but thank you, Suzanne, really great to see you. And we will see you soon.

 

Megan

Okay. So we've just arrived in Peebles. We've just had a really lovely morning in Kelso

 

Paul

Really, really enjoyed that.

 

Megan

Yeah. We also got some lunch there, which was really nice. And we are now off to speak to Struan from Blackwood and Smith about the market down in Peebles and what it’s like to live here.

 

Paul

Yeah, and it was such a lovely drive across as well. It was, you know, it really is. It's something serious. Breathtaking.

 

Megan

Yeah. It's you'll see if you're watching on YouTube, you've seen some of our footage of our trip down from Kelso on the GoPro. And also if you're listening on Spotify. Oh, yes, you're using a new tool. You can vote in our poll. So we're just going to trial it for this episode.

 

Paul

Paul or Megan?!

 

Megan

No, we’re not asking that, we’re going to ask you, what is your favorite Scottish borders town? So you can pick from Kelso, Peebles, Melrose or Selkirk, and so head over to Spotify and you can cast your vote.

 

Paul

That's a tough one.

 

Megan

But yeah, we're off to go and see Struan now and we'll catch up with you afterwards.

 

Paul

Cheers, guys.

 

Megan

Okay, so we have now arrived in Peebles in the Scottish Borders, and we're here with Struan. He's a partner at Blackwood and Smith. We're here to talk about life in Peebles, so Struan I wonder if you could just let us know a little bit about Peebles. And I know you don't live in Peebles itself, but what is it like?

What's the community like here in Peebles?

 

Struan

So it's a great place. Although I don't live in Peebles, I have worked here for about 12 years and I went to school here back in the day. So I've always lived nearby Peebles, I’ve just never managed to move here myself, but it's it's a great place to live, great place to work. Lots of, you know, lots of lovely scenery, as you can see behind us here, and lots of good community organizations, lots of things going on.

It's really, you know, one of those places, it's just really busy. There's always stuff happening, whether it's, you know, local festivals, mountain biking, anything, you know, we can there we had the the local Highland Games the weekend before it was the agricultural show. There's always stuff going on. It's a really, really kind of vibrant place. And I know people in the city may look at somewhere like this and think, I'm not sure about that, but it really is.

There's a lot going on down here.

 

Megan

Oh definitely. We arrived here this afternoon and the town center is a bit of a hubbub of activity having when Paul and I have been to other towns, You know, a lot of the time, people they’re really trying to encourage that town center activity. But Peebles definitely already seems to have that. So in terms of moving here, if someone was thinking about moving to Peebles, what is the property market like in Peebles In the kind of surrounding area?

 

Struan

It's always got quite a good market. I mean, we don't quite have you know, if people are moving out from Edinburgh, they're probably used to turning up at open viewings and finding 15 people. Peebles isn't quite like that. There's not not as many people browsing the properties down here, but and obviously there's not nearly as many properties, but it's it's one of those places that is known to be a really nice place to live.

You can you can live somewhere like this with good facilities, good schools and all this countryside around you. Lots of things to see and do. And yet Edinburgh still just right there on your doorstep and you can get into the center of town in an hour and a lot of people around here, there's plenty of people work here in Peebles, but a lot people are working, are living here so that they can then be commuting to Edinburgh.

But in terms of the, you know, the attractions of coming somewhere like this, you're coming for the community, for, you know, a nice safe, clean place to live. You don't get much trouble around here and there's lots of lots of really lovely places to stay, not just in Peebles, but obviously all around here and lots of lots of towns that sort of center around Peebles, the likes of Innerleithen and Cardrona and Walkerburn and West Linton, Broughton - Peebles is sort of their local center, where the high school is, where a lot of the facilities are.

But all of these towns lovely places.

 

Megan

So I think something that we've seen across the whole area and regions of the ESPC covers is that, you know, that since COVID hybrid working, working from home is encouraged a lot of people to move out of the city. Did you find that you had an influx of maybe Edinburgh City dwellers coming to Peebles?

 

Struan

Well, yeah, it's always quite hard to tell because in around this area we've always had even long before COVID a lot of buyers to this area are people moving out of Edinburgh. And so it was hard to tell whether that happened more than beforehand. But we also get a lot of people moving up from England and even people moving up from from London even.

And so I think maybe that's perhaps the, you know, what we see more is not necessarily Edinburgh people working from home, it's people from even further away coming somewhere like this because they can then still be working from, you know, from somewhere nice, like they're still having a job in one of the big cities.

 

Megan

Yeah. No, it's, it's a gorgeous little town. So you mentioned that you get a lot of buyers from England, something that we were chatting about just before we hit record is that kind of a the difference in obviously the English property system and the Scottish system. How does that affect property sales up here? You know, is it, you know, with regards to chains and England and things.

 

Struan

So yeah, that, that is always an issue, but it's probably not quite as big an issue as people sometimes make out. There's this there's this fear that anybody that's selling in England is going to be trouble. But we we get a lot of lots of people who are buying, who are selling in England or somebody further down the chain is selling in England.

And in most cases, once you get them on board with the idea that they actually have to pick a date to work towards, then everything tends to you know, it tends to be okay. And you can have clients favoring an offer where somebody's selling in Scotland over someone selling in England and then still have, you know, a problem arising because of a Scottish sale.

So and it's not necessarily a huge problem. One of the perception issues you have is we get people coming up from England and browsing the houses and saying that they're moving to the area and they don't actually realize that they need to have a Scottish solicitor. And so they're then sort of caught in the hop when they've accepted an offer in England and suddenly need to do something here.

And they've not appointed a Scottish solicitor, which would be ideally what they should be doing at the outset to make sure that some of these they're to no interest and submit offers and talk them through the system as well because they're going to end up having two different transactions with completely different contracts and different titles and everything. So having solicitors advising you right from the outset of what the differences are and what to expect on this side of the board is quite important.

 

Megan

Oh, there we go. We've got bells again in the background. We have the same in Kelso and so in terms of duration of how long does it take to to sell in Peebles what's your kind of average time frame that it’s taking to sell?

 

Struan

To be honest, I'm not too sure. It varies enormously. I mean, obviously we have some properties in the market and we'll sell immediately. And then unfortunately, others will will go in the market and and sit there for sometimes a few months, sometimes longer. It very much depends on the property and and who's out there at that point. And obviously if that's something you can get in any area of the market. But at certainly around here where there's not as many properties come on the market, there's much more variance and that you'll certainly get you'll get some that sell straightaway and others that that will take some time and that the properties that tend to really get the most attention around here will be the ones that aren't even actually in the town.

It will be the ones that have, you know, the set out on their own with some scenery around them. And those tend to get a lot of interest. But it's not necessarily something that will then sale straight away because a lot of people will go and look at it. But it's not everybody's cup of tea when they actually realize that they're, you know, slightly more complicated. Having a house sits on the side of a hill with private water and private drainage.

 

Megan

Yes, absolutely. And in terms of hotspots, it will if you pull the lens out of just just focusing on Peebles. What would you say are the hotspots for maybe first time buyers if they're looking to buy locally?

 

Struan

Sure. So certainly get plenty of first time buyers and people's. But and one area locally that tends to get a lot of attention is Innerleithen. So Innerleithen, that's actually where I'm from originally, but it's changed a lot since I grew up there and it's now, you know, it's almost like a, you know, almost like a resort town as far as mountain biking is concerned.

If you go there at the weekend, you will see mountain bikers everywhere. And it's one of the top mountain biking destinations in the country. You get several times a year. There'll be major competitions happening there. And and it's got this vibrancy partly due to the mountain biking, but partly just the, you know, the the look of the town, the high street.

And it's not a large commercial high street like the likes of Innerleithen with lots of properties. And so the businesses there, they're all little small, independent, really popular businesses. And Innerleithen just got this, this thing about it that a lot of people and a lot of people must, must see that. And it tends to be a lot of younger people, not necessarily first time buyers, but we certainly if I have a call from a youngish person wanting to buy a property locally, it's frequently Innerleithan.

 

Megan

And in terms of maybe house prices. And Alison, what's the kind of ballpark figure if a first time buyer is maybe looking to buy there.

 

Struan

And probably in the region of I guess anywhere from about £100000 to £150000, which if you were comparing that to Edinburgh and what you would get in Edinburgh, you would be you'd be well out of the town. Whereas in Innerleithen that would probably get you quite a nice, quite a nice flat in Innerleithan.

 

Megan

Oh well that's great. It's always nice to hear. I'm looking at Paul behind the camera and we always like to find a first name buyer kind of property prices in all the different areas. In terms of just to wrap up, we're thinking we always ask about beauty spots. Is there where do some of your favorite places locally to maybe go the weekend or yeah, go for a walk.

 

Struan

Sure. So I live in West Linton. There's lots of lovely walks around there up and the edge of the Pentland If you were down in Peebles and if you're not walking and you're on a mountain bike, a lot people would be at Glen Trace or down to Innerleithen and you've got the Manor Valley, which is still very kind of behind these hills behind us there, which is quite sort of untouched.

You know, it's very quiet, single track roads out there. If you wanted somewhere more secluded, that would be where you can go. And lots of good hill walking around here and and I suppose another place that's always really nice is down to square, which is just south of Innerleithen. Lots of of the countryside there and there.

 

Megan

You know, definitely is on the drive here that the scenery is beautiful. So I'm sure there's lots of places to go in terms of looking ahead then for the property market, something that we've discussed quite a lot with lots of different member firms, it's quite a difficult time to tell what's going to happen. Schools have just gone back and you mentioned obviously the English schools I think are just going back and know while we're here.

So we're not 100% sure. But what's your kind of outlook for the rest of 2023?

 

Struan

Yeah, it's it is really difficult to say. I mean, certainly we had a couple of years of such a buoyant market from mid 2020 onwards, whereas this year has been much quieter. And what's not helped I suppose is the the rate rises that we've had regularly. And I'm certainly hoping that those are going to level off. That's what the news keeps saying.

That will happen eventually and I'm hoping that that would give people a bit more confidence. I can see why. If you were thinking of making a house move at the moment, you're wondering where those interest rates are going to end up when when the sort of level off although they might be much higher than before. And, you know, people can you know, they know what the mortgage payments are going to be.

They're going to know that hopefully that, you know, if they can pick something that they can afford, then in the longer term, it will work for them. So hopefully that's all going to level off and the market may then sort of, you know, smooth out a bit. But it's actually, you know, the last couple of years were not good years for people like first time buyers because they were being priced out of so many properties because the market was so buoyant.

So at the moment, yes, they'll find that they're paying a lot more for the mortgages, but they're also not needing, you know, a huge deposit on top of the valuation because they're competing with a lot less people when they're when they're looking at properties. So and, you know, there's there's always, you know, a balancing act there. And so it's not all you you know, it's not all positive, but it's not all negative either.

And there's always stuff happening. If you want to sell your home, you can still sell your home at the moment. And large parts in the market are just are moving okay. Despite, you know, what you might read in parts of the news.

 

Megan

I think that is a great place to wrap up. Thank you so much for your time. And stay. And I'm sure Paul and I will be back in the Borders very soon because we've really enjoyed our day down here. Thanks so much, Struan

 

Struan

Thank you.